Live blogging from Wafa Sultan’s talk here in Boston. She was asked by a member of the audience: “What about American atrocities like corporate greed and the income gap?” She responded:
I was asked by the Al Jazeera interviewer why I was more American than the Americans. I said, because I was born in hell and came to paradise. Americans are born in paradise and don’t know about hell. I don’t blame them for it. But I love every moment in America. Every time I walk down the street and am not called a whore, I love it.
My candidate for both civic heroism and the courage to feel and show gratitude.
And that my dears is why it is called civilisation.
Comment by Richard — November 7, 2007 @ 4:04 am
Those who have tasted even a touch of tyranny seem far more attuned to the ultimate goodness of civil society, of democracy, of America, than those whose minds have grown fat and complacent from the lifelong enjoyment of the benefits those things bring.
Thus Nabokov (Martin Amis’s role-model in this as in other things):
“From his days as a student in Cambridge in 1920 until the end of his life, he fought, with the contempt of knowledge for ignorance, Western apologists for and prettifiers of Bolshevism. His unsleeping eye for — his tactless voice against — all varieties of such wicked nonsense cost Nabokov, it is very likely, the Nobel Prize. (Losing it, of course, excluded him from Pearl Buck’s table and banished him to the kitchen with Tolstoy, Chekhov, James, Conrad, Proust, and Joyce.)”
We know now - more than ever before - what worthlessness attaches to that particular brand-name among baubles.
Nabokov’s family left Russia to escape the rise of tyranny there, and later he and his wife left Paris for New York on one of the last boats to escape the Nazi invasion. Even after he had finally left the USA to settle in Switzerland, he retained his US citizenship, paid US taxes, and would not hear a word said against the country that had adopted him in times of danger. He was also a profound loather of anti-Semitism.
Is it an inherent weakness of democracy that people who have known no other form of government take it so glibly and derisively for granted? Should the system be amended in such a way that, say, once every twenty years we are forced to endure five years of barbaric totalitarian rule, in order that we might live the rest of our lives profoundly grateful for where we live and what we have built for ourselves?
My heart smiles when I read the exceptional words of Wafa Sultan.
Comment by Michael N — November 7, 2007 @ 5:41 am
I think what happens is people living in the West do take their freedoms for granted, and see them as the norm, not as something special. From this starting point, they are free to focus on the faults of Western countries.
The corruption and socio-economic inequality in many Western countries are real enough, but many in the West don’t understand that it has precisely been democracy and a strong civil society that have lessened these evils over time, though there is a long way to go yet. Instead, they see these problems as inherent in democratic society, or, actually, in capitalist society. They don’t understand that no model of government or economy can overnight correct problems inherent in the society itself (in the “pays réel” as opposed to the “pays légal”).
Thus, capitalism reflects racism, even if it didn’t create it. American democracy reflects racism, and even upheld it in law at first. It had to evolve away from racism, and it is going in the right direction with the help of democratic institutions and values. Will it ever be a society totally free of racism? Probably not. The only societies that display no racism are those that don’t have more than one race. [Then the citizens just hate each other over religion, class, the color of their eyes, whatever.]
There is inequality inherent in capitalism, and this has to be addressed. That’s why capitalist countries have “mixed economies,” and most have a stronger welfare state than America’s. They may call themselves “socialist” or “social democratic,” but they maintain a democratic form of government, a lively civil society, and private economic sector. This is all in an attempt to combine the best in capitalism and socialism, without incurring the problems each system poses in its purer form. But this may not be enough for some radicals, who seem to resent–above all things–systems characterized by banality, middle-class values, compromise, and the “juste milieu.”
I understand Noam Chomsky calls himself an anarchist. What does that mean, exactly? Where has there been a workable “anarchic” system in a big, complex modern country? And yet this is taken seriously by his far-left readers, something that can only happen among those who have the luxury of treating concepts so irresponsibly. Could you imagine preaching anarchy in Rwanda, or the Sudan, or Gaza? Oh, never mind Gaza. They already have it.
When it comes to international relations, many in the West deeply regret the inequalities between North and South. And they remember the power games played between the USA and USSR during the Cold War, involving invasions, coups d’état, and support for dictators. They believe that the USA is still at it today, with the Iraq War as a prime example. They also see the depredations of the multinational companies in the Third World during the last half century or so, especially in Latin America.
A lot of what they criticize is real enough. But when it comes to foreign affairs, they again view the world through one eye. The record for the USA is mixed. Moreover, given the nature of international politics since Thucydides (and long before that), some cynicism and compromise of pure ethical standards are inevitable, even for the most benign states.
Yes, their critiques contain a lot of truth, but the truths are mixed in with half-truths and lies. Their own moral compass goes further askew when they idolize Third World leaders. They are eminently forgiving of Muslim demagogues and dictators. They refuse to see anything wrong with Chavez and Castro. They worship Che. They might criticize Mugabe, but not often and not with enthusiasm. They do criticize Arafat, but not for all the right reasons.
And, again, they worship Che. I tried to tell one lady that Che set up a “gulag” of camps for political prisoners, and that he ordered hundreds of executions, including executions of fellow revolutionaries –socialists, social democrats, democrats, what have you– who weren’t sufficiently with the party line. She refused to believe me!
People like this tend to compare the Western reality, warts and all, with…not the reality elsewhere, but with the ideal version of elsewhere. So the West cannot win.
Maybe it’s a question of familiarity breeding contempt. Maybe it’s a question of the narcissism of small differences, or of an adolescent rebellion that they never outgrew. But I think that their “complacency” consists, indeed, as Michael N says above, of taking the value of democracy for granted. It’s like oxygen in the air; they’re hardly aware that they’re benefiting from it.
What makes this all frustrating is that a good deal of what they say is true enough, so they can string together compelling arguments that are hard to answer. They just don’t have the life experience to put it all into perspective.
Comment by Joanne — November 7, 2007 @ 1:51 pm
having been born and raised until 13 in Romania, I can attest that, indeed, attest that we appreciated the west — israel and the us — much more than the natives.
unfortunately, however, as immigrants we are also more sensitive to the west’s deffects, as it is hardly perfect. and we can certainly discern much faster when it deteriorates.
I also understand how wafa appreciates it much more than I do, given where as a woman she comes from. thus, I see the flaws more than she does. here’s one attempt to describe it:
LENIN, TROTSKY, AND FREEDOM FROM THE TYRANNY OF KNOWLEDGE AND REASON
http://www.dbdebunk.com/page/page/1282191.htm
fp
http://fallofknowledgeandreason.blogspot.com/
Comment by fp — November 7, 2007 @ 1:56 pm
Joanne, I’m glad that you see through Che. Having read one of his books and many quotes from him, I can say that he was more interested in the romantic violence of struggle [kampf, lucha] and “revolution” than in what comes after, that is, in actually building a better society. He and Castro both had a fascination with death, as in Castro’s slogan: Patria o muerte!! [fatherland or death]. This is very close to words uttered by the Spanish falangistas, fascists, at a notorious meeting held at the University of Salamanca in the presence of the philosopher Unamuno. Whereas Castro shouted: Patria o muerte!!, Franco’s general Millan Astray led a chant of his men in which they shouted Espana!!, the name of their patria, and muerte, over and over.
So Fidel and Che’s values were very close to those of the Spanish fascists [falangistas] and I believe that Che’s adoration of La Lucha was all too reminiscent of Hitler’s kampf.
Comment by Eliyahu — November 10, 2007 @ 6:09 pm
it should be obvious that the left-right continuum is actually a circle, where its extremes meet. there was very little difference in the methods and outcome of soviet communism and nazism.
Comment by fp — November 10, 2007 @ 11:32 pm
Eliyahu; Kampf, Lucha - yes, but I believe that you omitted one other word that translates as “struggle”, a word that is heard increasingly in Western discourse, and also denotes a ’struggle’ to overthrow Western civilisation in the name of peace and justice imposed through violence and cruelty.
I like to play this game with my long-suffering BBC friend. When discussing matters islamic I tell her that Jihad means “Holy War”, at which she quickly and eagerly jumps in to correct me, “No, it means ’struggle’.”
“I know”, I reply, “it’s the same as the ‘kampf’… in Mein Kampf”
Then she realises I am mocking her, and I have to resort to my charming smile. A childish pleasure and a miniature victory, I concede, but I enjoy it nevertheless.
Comment by Michael N — November 11, 2007 @ 5:55 pm
For me, Wafa’s words carry such weight because they are true and completely free of pretense and guile. She speaks with complete bravery; bold and arrogant in her truth. She doesn’t mince words, but she is also not violent or scathing in her speech. She merely speaks the truth…and allows the truth to do what it may.
Comment by Joe — December 17, 2007 @ 8:10 pm
I am refreshed by Wafa, finally a brave voice speaks for peace. May God, by whatever name she or he may be called, bless her greatly.
Comment by Jacqueline — February 3, 2008 @ 9:39 pm
Wafa and her likes try to build their reputation by turning on their roots… they would do anything to please the hands that feeds them and pay them high wages!
America remains by in large a terrorist state and its history from the genocide of the Indians, the massacres in Vietnam to the over 1 million Iraqis killed, is witness that it has been built on greed and blood.
Wafa can praise its master… but it can’t change history and the truth.
Comment by Socrates — March 6, 2008 @ 4:52 am
[…] تمشي في الشارع بدون أن ينادي عليها أحد بلقب عاهرة (انقر الرابط) و كاننا في بلادنا نادي النساء بأنهن عاهرات !!!هذا طبع […]
Pingback by نحن نعطيهم أكثر من قدرهم… « Arabi100’s — March 17, 2008 @ 1:19 am
The lady says She is happy in the state because when she walks the streets she is not called a WHORE ? Is she implying that when she walked the streets of DAMASCUS or BANIAS ” Where she was born” people used to call her WHORE? This lady claims to have PhD in psychology!!!
Comment by edlancer — April 5, 2008 @ 1:22 am
This is total bullshit and it is very wrong for her to talk like that. i think she is talking nonsence. she is out of her mind.
Comment by sha — April 22, 2008 @ 11:31 am
HHHHMMMMMMMMM
As a westerner who is living in the middle east for decades with my family, I find it amusing to hear Mrs. Sultan’s claim. No one is able to verbally or physically assault females in the middle east. To the contrary the statistics show a rape incident every 5 minutes in the U.S.
I must say that my family and I have been treated with respect by Muslims and Christians of the Middle East.
Mrs. Sultan, please whom are you kidding?
Comment by Art — May 9, 2008 @ 11:26 am
It never fails to astound how liberal America Haters will try to rewrite another’s personal history to fit their own warped view. A westerner who was treated well by Middle Easterners is not a recommendation to anything. Unless you are or were a Muslim Woman living in the Middle East you have no right to question her honesty. Sultan is not the only one who has attested to the horrors of Islamo-fascism. This is not new information - and people who act as though they live under a tyrannical state in America are deluded children.
P.S. Noam Chomsky is an opportunistic hypocrite millionaire who lives in a big Mansion.
Comment by Faye — July 5, 2008 @ 2:30 pm
I’m trying to get Mrs. Wafa Sultan’s e-mail address. If you have it, kindly i require to sent it to me. Thanks. CP.
Comment by Carlos Pereira — August 6, 2008 @ 1:04 pm
أكاد أجزم بأن هذه المرأة ليست مسلمة، فمن ذاق حلاوة الاسلام ليس بمقدوره التفوه بمثل هذا الكلام البذيء. الاسلام دين حق وخلق، قد حفظ كرامة المرأة وحقوقها.
لا يمكنني القول بأن هذه المرأة الملحدة(وفاء) مجنونة لأنني قد سأبرر لها أفعالها وأقوالها التي لا تمد للإسلام بصلة ولكنني متأكدة بأن ما فعلته هو من أجل المال والجنسية الاميريكية والشهرة التي ستجني من ورائها المال الكثير
أما بشأن ما تقوله عن كونها تمشي في الشارع دون ان تسمع كلمة (عاهرة) …بالله عليكم معشر المسلمين والعرب أسبق وأن حدث مثل هذا في عالمنا الاسلامي والعربي!!!
أقسم بأن من يراها في اميركا يبصق في وجهها وينظر اليها نظرة الخائن الذي خان دينه وبلده من أجل حفنة من المال…قبح الله وجهها ووجه زوجها
i am about to be sure that this woman is not muslim or is no longer muslim bceause whoever tastes the woderful and the greatness of islam will not say such a terrible words about it.
islam is the religion of right and morals, it has given the woman her full rights to live, give her opinion, own what ewver she wants and the most her right of full education.
about this woman (wafa), i can not say that is crazy beacuse i will give her an excuse, but i am sure that waht she has done is not about islam but about money, the american citizen and the fame…!!!! what a Traitor!!!
about her say of being walking without hearing the word(whore) for godsake……… what a big liar!!!
the american TV does not lie and no one who is american will deny this when he reads my comment … i challange any one dares to do it… i dont mean to be rude at all but i trust islam and very confident of it otherwise i would not be a muslim girl…
for who reads my comment and is not muslim… i am sure that you look at this woman as a traitor and you will never trust her… ever!!!
you are very welcom to send your comment to my e-mail nightlight86@yahoo.com
Comment by amon — September 13, 2008 @ 3:25 am
Wafa, U’R FULL OF HATE AND HATE. We should start by solving our damn problems first, reality is the best truth-, and everything you say are lies and modified…..however, I am converting to Islam.
Comment by tony — September 17, 2008 @ 2:39 am
waffa sultan know well what she tell and i understand well what she means more than american women
the american women can not imagine the hell of arabic and islamic situation for woman that are reaaly intelligents with creation mental and free conscieuse
it is a rely hell
ordinary woman could lie and close eyes
but a woman with good and healthy spirit and dignity can not
all muslim man are realy perverted in all their dimension life not only woman and sexuality
they project in the world their own mentals and physicals vices and corruptions
and mohamed their leader was not better than hitler or mussolini or any political tyran he was the WORST TYRAN in the human hisory STOP NAMED HIM A PROPHETE
SO ALL MY RESPECT
Comment by sanekli monia — April 24, 2009 @ 12:59 am
she (wafa) could have sexual problem and wished to live in a society that she descrbed from her imagination ( khalifa omar ibn alkhattab) full of sexual liberty where women existed only to raise their legs … wafa is dreaming of rhat as nowadays MEN are so busy and have no time to practice sexuality everday .. she left to US where the freedom could giue her more chances to practise her sexual obsession evey night and of course nowbody will call her A WHORE…but DAMASCUS is a small country in comparison to US so she is afraid to hear : HEY YOU WHORE..
Wafa you believe in the stick of prophete MOISE? DO you believe that jesus wake up dead people from their tombs? of course yes but you do not believe that the holy coran are the words of almighty god … i know the reason .. dollars… you worship ..this your god ..go to hell
Comment by mondher — May 9, 2009 @ 2:59 am
This lady needs some popularity in USA for some political or economic gains, she is spreading a propaganda against her former religion ie Islam, it is understood she is Hypocritical to Islam, how can she be faithful to USA, its a big question
Comment by James — July 14, 2009 @ 5:18 am